PS3 this November
Actually they were very careful in how they worded it. They said all of the demos are representations of what they thought the games would look like. They made no guarantee's that the games graphics would end up like that in the end. The graphics card in the PS3 will be the same as a current generation GeForce 7800 graphics card. That card is just not capable of those cg-like graphics and the Cell processor was nothing more than a paper spec when they created those vids.
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Undead_Mercenary
- Posts: 2914
- Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 10:01 am
- Location: Barrie, Ontario
Even though Killzone 2 trailer is very likely to not be actual real-time gameplay, the presentations for Metal Gear Solid 4 and Unreal Tournament '07 are confirmed to be real-time on prototype PS3 tech, and on a graphical scale, Killzone 2 wasn't <i>much</i> further ahead of MGS4 or UT07.
Considering how good those two confirmed games look, once the second/third generation of PS3 comes around and the tricks for console development start to be realized, Killzone 2's looks would be absolutely plausible. Course, you could knock down the graphics in Killzone 2 and it'd be just another FPS for this generation.
"the controller alone makes console games beat the shit out of computer peripherals for any game that doesn't need a mouse for precision or thirty hotkeys, which is every genre except shooters or mass war games"
Considering how good those two confirmed games look, once the second/third generation of PS3 comes around and the tricks for console development start to be realized, Killzone 2's looks would be absolutely plausible. Course, you could knock down the graphics in Killzone 2 and it'd be just another FPS for this generation.
"the controller alone makes console games beat the shit out of computer peripherals for any game that doesn't need a mouse for precision or thirty hotkeys, which is every genre except shooters or mass war games"
The demos for MGS4 and UT2K7 were rendered in realtime, but they were just engine demos. There was no physics going on in them and no ai calculations, they were the same as you'd get from the latest ATI or NVIDIA realtime demos or from running 3dMark06 and are not a good indication of what the games will look like.
I'm not saying the graphics aren't going to be great, just don't expect them to be on-par with the demo's being shown.
I'm not saying the graphics aren't going to be great, just don't expect them to be on-par with the demo's being shown.
with the exception of sports games and racing games (guess that is a sport too) pc is betterDenKirson wrote:
"the controller alone makes console games beat the shit out of computer peripherals for any game that doesn't need a mouse for precision or thirty hotkeys, which is every genre except shooters or mass war games"
fps
rpg
strategy
games (poker)
pc is best at all of these and that is what I play
and for flight simulators I have my trusty joystick with a bazillion buttons so computers win again
ONLY thing console is good for is two people playing a sports game together on the same machine, or racing cars.
mouse = greater control
keyboard = greater range of configurations
monitor = better resolution
puters are just better... I have played console games from pong to ps2 with pretty much every variant in between (even intellivision and Odessey 2) so it isnt like i have not had any experience with them, i play hockey on mine, that is all, nothing else, and only when i have company....
Yaz: "Water sucks, Gatorade is better."
What does your playing pong and bringing up intellivision do for whatever argument you're maing?
I could say PC is superior because I cannot add mods or make my own material for a game on a console which would both enrich the original game and increase replayability, and true that is, this isn't about monitors prettyness or making your pistol fire nuclear warheads.
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Mouse: Superior accuracy, Inferior consistency.
Keyboard: Superior many input keys, Inferior 0 or 1 input level.
"Joystick": Superior control precision, Inferior scheme diversity.
Keyboards are inferior for <i>controlling</i> movement, thumbsticks are inferior for <i>accuracy</i> in aiming speed, and a mouse is inferior for <i>consistency</i> in gradual movement. So, pinpoint the issue that concerns all three (precision versus accuracy over control) and bring in the good thing that the controller trumps the keyboard with for one purpose and let the mouse do its thing= The sensitive stick for control.
WASD, the primary default keys for nearly any well-known PC game, is inferior.
Switch WASD with a little stick while having a bunch of easily-accessable buttons and a mouse, and all is right, you wouldn't even have to get a seperate flightstick for vehicles, either.
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Field Test: Battlefield 2 or Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Bind walking keys to the pressure-sensitive (thumb/joy)stick. Move. Witness control over movement in more than eight directions and at indeterminate levels of speed. Experiment with inching around and compare with tapping a keyboard key.
Results
Keyboard: (0 or 1, off or on, empty or full input) ; rigid and plain ; four keys required.
-----Stick: (100 levels of input at increasing value) ; smooth and consistent ; one 'digit' required.
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Here is the solution, the best of both.
What does your playing pong and bringing up intellivision do for whatever argument you're maing?
I could say PC is superior because I cannot add mods or make my own material for a game on a console which would both enrich the original game and increase replayability, and true that is, this isn't about monitors prettyness or making your pistol fire nuclear warheads.
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Mouse: Superior accuracy, Inferior consistency.
Keyboard: Superior many input keys, Inferior 0 or 1 input level.
"Joystick": Superior control precision, Inferior scheme diversity.
Keyboards are inferior for <i>controlling</i> movement, thumbsticks are inferior for <i>accuracy</i> in aiming speed, and a mouse is inferior for <i>consistency</i> in gradual movement. So, pinpoint the issue that concerns all three (precision versus accuracy over control) and bring in the good thing that the controller trumps the keyboard with for one purpose and let the mouse do its thing= The sensitive stick for control.
WASD, the primary default keys for nearly any well-known PC game, is inferior.
Switch WASD with a little stick while having a bunch of easily-accessable buttons and a mouse, and all is right, you wouldn't even have to get a seperate flightstick for vehicles, either.
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Field Test: Battlefield 2 or Dungeons and Dragons Online.
Bind walking keys to the pressure-sensitive (thumb/joy)stick. Move. Witness control over movement in more than eight directions and at indeterminate levels of speed. Experiment with inching around and compare with tapping a keyboard key.
Results
Keyboard: (0 or 1, off or on, empty or full input) ; rigid and plain ; four keys required.
-----Stick: (100 levels of input at increasing value) ; smooth and consistent ; one 'digit' required.
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Here is the solution, the best of both.
the point of my experience with consoles is that i have experience so I dont have to listen to "you are closed minded and dont use them", nothing beats mouse + keyboard for precision, and accuracy in movement... the whole concept of wasd is bs, i use the w key for movement and mouselook... mouselook is BETTER than the thumb stick... AND I set a and d to strafe so i can walk sideways and forward while moving in mouselook.... sorry i still say console controllers are inferior in every single way with the afore mentioned exceptions from my previous posts...
my sig is going into overdrive.
my sig is going into overdrive.
I would not attack your credibility by doubting your "experience" or spouting my library of games from decades ago to win a topic when we are supposed to be arguing as peers. Shit, I played Intellivision too, had those two built-in controllers with the cool metal disc that worked as a joystick, enjoyed "Pitfall" and that one with the track events, and I wouldn't care if you've never played a console before XBox360.
I'm here:
And you're somewhere over here:
Get away from the mouse. We're not talking about the mouse, I said in my last post that aiming/viewing with the mouse beats the stick and the only thing a controller has over the computer is the stick versus WASD.
I'm talking about the keyboard versus a stick for precision. Precision has a very specific meaning and is not the same as accuracy, another word used with meaning for the purpose of this. A keyboard has no precision and is only useful for the number of buttons to map actions to. A nubby stick has precision and requires only one finger/thumb as opposed to the four keys needing three fingers for "optimal" control.
And no matter how used one gets to three fingers on four different buttons, the requirement to remove one finger to press surrounding keys other than shift, tab or space, for even a quarter of a second, creates an inefficency that neither skill or preference can refute, but can ignore at a minor loss.
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Maybe that could be another signature image of yours, some console controllers in a puddle of urine in a white expanse and your handle in shiny letters.
I'm here:
And you're somewhere over here:
Get away from the mouse. We're not talking about the mouse, I said in my last post that aiming/viewing with the mouse beats the stick and the only thing a controller has over the computer is the stick versus WASD.
I'm talking about the keyboard versus a stick for precision. Precision has a very specific meaning and is not the same as accuracy, another word used with meaning for the purpose of this. A keyboard has no precision and is only useful for the number of buttons to map actions to. A nubby stick has precision and requires only one finger/thumb as opposed to the four keys needing three fingers for "optimal" control.
And no matter how used one gets to three fingers on four different buttons, the requirement to remove one finger to press surrounding keys other than shift, tab or space, for even a quarter of a second, creates an inefficency that neither skill or preference can refute, but can ignore at a minor loss.
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Maybe that could be another signature image of yours, some console controllers in a puddle of urine in a white expanse and your handle in shiny letters.
a computer = mouse + keyboard for controlling
as I said I dont us asdw, i use w for moving forward and mouse to move 90% of the time... backwards is not usd as much... sometimes I use straffing and backwards to walk in circles around things without changing the direction I look, something the thumb pad cannot do. I use u,e,r,t,z,c,shift,control, and alt keys as well... I did talk to someone about using tfgh so i had more buttn options... mouselook is how i change aspect ratio.
you cant look at one gear in the transmission and say this car is better, it is the whole package. I do know the difference between accuracy and precision, hence in my previous post i say "accuracy AND precision"...
all in all... all i have been saying, and am still saying, reguardless of any individual point is console games suck compaired to computer games due to the controllers used with the exeption of two people playing simotaniously on one screen, and racing games.
as I said I dont us asdw, i use w for moving forward and mouse to move 90% of the time... backwards is not usd as much... sometimes I use straffing and backwards to walk in circles around things without changing the direction I look, something the thumb pad cannot do. I use u,e,r,t,z,c,shift,control, and alt keys as well... I did talk to someone about using tfgh so i had more buttn options... mouselook is how i change aspect ratio.
you cant look at one gear in the transmission and say this car is better, it is the whole package. I do know the difference between accuracy and precision, hence in my previous post i say "accuracy AND precision"...
all in all... all i have been saying, and am still saying, reguardless of any individual point is console games suck compaired to computer games due to the controllers used with the exeption of two people playing simotaniously on one screen, and racing games.
yeah, like the guy that they put on the back of trucks? or look up a band called the ciricle jerks, they had an album called golden shower of hits... the cover to that would work tooMaybe that could be another signature image of yours, some console controllers in a puddle of urine in a white expanse and your handle in shiny letters.
"you cant look at one gear in the transmission and say this car is better"
We're not talking about the car (console/PC), I'm talking about the transmission (controller) and ONLY specific gears (left thumb stick and keyboard WASD default for moving an entity in most game standards)! This isn't about Console versus PC, not about Halo versus Doom3, and not about the mouse being superior for fast interface.
"I do know the difference between accuracy and precision"
Not if you lump them together for the mouse. You cannot keep a constant and direct movement speed with a mouse, it will not make a path that has equal increments of length between A and B due to either the human hand's inexactness controlling it or because you're going to run out of table to drag the mouse on.
I'll use the same dumb referential replacement of objects that does nothing but require the others to figure out what new object is supposed to be what originally:
-Steer a car (game, FPS mainly) with two buttons that immediately turn your wheels in one direction (keyboard), on a 15° curve roa--WHOA CRAP I FLIPPED OVER (walked out too far).
-Steer with a big (thumb)stick that you can angle slightly and hold in place on a 15° curve. Wow, hey, no unecessary exaggerated movements and I have absolute control over how far I turn.
"i dont us asdw - i use w for moving forward and mouse to move 90% of the time... backwards is not usd as much... (and) I set a and d to strafe"
Sure as hell sounds like you use WASD. Oh, you don't walk backwards all that much so it doesn't count. Regardless, get away from the mouse already.
"mouselook is how i change aspect ratio"
Wait, go back to the mouse for a moment. You configured your mouse to switch between different resolutions like 1600X1200 and 1600X900 when you move it around?
"I use straffing and backwards to walk in circles around things without changing the direction I look, something the thumb pad cannot do"
What!? EXPLAIN THIS. I want to read how you can come to that absurd comment.
You can walk a SQUARE or an OCTAGON around things with a keyboard without looking elsewhere. You can walk an actual CIRCLE with a left thumbstick and not touch the right stick and still be facing wherever you were in the first place.
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Also:
We're not talking about the car (console/PC), I'm talking about the transmission (controller) and ONLY specific gears (left thumb stick and keyboard WASD default for moving an entity in most game standards)! This isn't about Console versus PC, not about Halo versus Doom3, and not about the mouse being superior for fast interface.
"I do know the difference between accuracy and precision"
Not if you lump them together for the mouse. You cannot keep a constant and direct movement speed with a mouse, it will not make a path that has equal increments of length between A and B due to either the human hand's inexactness controlling it or because you're going to run out of table to drag the mouse on.
I'll use the same dumb referential replacement of objects that does nothing but require the others to figure out what new object is supposed to be what originally:
-Steer a car (game, FPS mainly) with two buttons that immediately turn your wheels in one direction (keyboard), on a 15° curve roa--WHOA CRAP I FLIPPED OVER (walked out too far).
-Steer with a big (thumb)stick that you can angle slightly and hold in place on a 15° curve. Wow, hey, no unecessary exaggerated movements and I have absolute control over how far I turn.
"i dont us asdw - i use w for moving forward and mouse to move 90% of the time... backwards is not usd as much... (and) I set a and d to strafe"
Sure as hell sounds like you use WASD. Oh, you don't walk backwards all that much so it doesn't count. Regardless, get away from the mouse already.
"mouselook is how i change aspect ratio"
Wait, go back to the mouse for a moment. You configured your mouse to switch between different resolutions like 1600X1200 and 1600X900 when you move it around?
"I use straffing and backwards to walk in circles around things without changing the direction I look, something the thumb pad cannot do"
What!? EXPLAIN THIS. I want to read how you can come to that absurd comment.
You can walk a SQUARE or an OCTAGON around things with a keyboard without looking elsewhere. You can walk an actual CIRCLE with a left thumbstick and not touch the right stick and still be facing wherever you were in the first place.
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Açieeed! style by