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Archangelus
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Archangelus
- Posts: 4286
- Joined: Mon Jun 24, 2002 9:01 pm
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Undead_Mercenary
- Posts: 2914
- Joined: Wed Aug 21, 2002 10:01 am
- Location: Barrie, Ontario
ohh the the crass, brash, arrogance and ignorance of youth. CAN-o-WORMS. Did Bush create terrorism? did Clinton have bin-laden's whereabouts after the embassy bombings (yes)? Was Saddam Hussein up for humanitarian of the year? 2000 soldiers died in 3 days on iwo jima protecting the world from evil and everyone is against this Iraq situation because 1000 brave US soldiers paid the ultimate price in two years? If 911 didn't happen who can say what the economy would have been like but that played a HUGE part in the down fall of the U.S. economy (much to the delite of the anti-american northern neighbors it seems) I will vote for Bush. My Brother fought in Kosovo bosnia, if you think the US took no casualties you again believe everything you read.....ohhh I have to stop I will be not reading this so when your done with your kent state fairy tales about the evil government and how world wide oppressive it is because bush is in POWER, go back to whatever sesame street reruns they have in Canada that you get your misinformation from and leave the voting to the ppl who it matters to. The men and women the States have in Iraq and in Afganistan are doing the job they were trained to do and told to do. the Canadians would have been much happier, so it seems, to just leave their good ole boy Saddam in power, no help from them eh. why are you doing the bush vs clinton thing try the Bush vs FrankenKerry. I now dislike tim horton's.
Here's my two cents on this.
1) Regarding Clinton ignoring Osama- he did. If you've read "Dereliction of Duty: The Eyewitness Account of How Bill Clinton Endangered America's Long-Term National Security" by Lt. Col Robert Patterson, USAF, Ret., then you would know that he was too busy chatting it up at a golfing event to bother ordering the strike to take out Osama. We had his location, we had the missles ready but good ole Bill didn't want to be bothered and we missed our chance. Not to mention when Sudan (pretty sure Sudan; if not then it was some other African nation circa 1996, 1997) offered up Osama on a plate to us. The result? Well...
2)Regarding Yaz on Bush winning in the electoral college being a flaw in the system- no, that's not a flaw, that's why the electoral system is there. When our founding fathers created our governing body the majority of the population were uneducated people, i.e. farmers. Most of the country at that time couldn't read or write, didn't have a handle on international situations. Also, we had really large populations in concentrated spots, such as New York City, Boston and Philedelphia to name a few. What do these two groups have in common? If one block decided to vote one way, as in ALL the farmers or ALL of one population center, it would have decided the entire outcome of the vote. Lets bring this into the modern day. Say all of New York City, Los Angeles and San Fransico decided to vote for Candidate X. That's about 30 million votes right there. That would be pretty tough to beat, right? You would just about have to carry the rest of the country, assuming that 50% of the country was still voting and not a single person in the entire US also votes for Candidate X.
It is this type of voting that our founding fathers didn't want. One population center, or just one group, ruling everyone. So they came up with the electoral college. Even if you carry New York and California, which have the largest population centers, you could still lose as we saw in 2000. This wasn't a mistake on their part. It was/ is a safe guard and I'm glad it's there.
Don't romanticise the Clinton era. He was good with the economy, and some foreign relations, but he was bad for the military and slack on a good bit of foreign relations. Just like our current president. He's good in some areas, bad in others. We look back on Lincoln and we see one of the greatest presidents, and human being, ever. Back in his day though, half of the US thought he was nuts and that is just in the Northern states alone! Won't even touch what the South thought of him. Only time will tell of the impact this government will have on this world. We're too close the epicenter of the events to see the outward ripples.
The End
PS- Personally, I don't give two shits what the rest of the world thinks of us. We've bailed the world out of so many situations, monetarily, equipment, US servicemen lives, since 1914 that we're allowed a mulligan or two. Did you know that England and Russia never paid us back for all the money and equipment we gave to them during WW2? They said, "We're not going to pay" and we didn't push the subject. We didn't invade them and we didn't do an economic/ logistic embargo on them. Also, did you know that in certain parts of our loving, all knowing, neighbors to the north that the Bible is considered hate speech and is not allowed to be taught? Class over.
Staff Sergant Thowarr, USAF, active duty, Keesler AFB, Biloxi MS
1) Regarding Clinton ignoring Osama- he did. If you've read "Dereliction of Duty: The Eyewitness Account of How Bill Clinton Endangered America's Long-Term National Security" by Lt. Col Robert Patterson, USAF, Ret., then you would know that he was too busy chatting it up at a golfing event to bother ordering the strike to take out Osama. We had his location, we had the missles ready but good ole Bill didn't want to be bothered and we missed our chance. Not to mention when Sudan (pretty sure Sudan; if not then it was some other African nation circa 1996, 1997) offered up Osama on a plate to us. The result? Well...
2)Regarding Yaz on Bush winning in the electoral college being a flaw in the system- no, that's not a flaw, that's why the electoral system is there. When our founding fathers created our governing body the majority of the population were uneducated people, i.e. farmers. Most of the country at that time couldn't read or write, didn't have a handle on international situations. Also, we had really large populations in concentrated spots, such as New York City, Boston and Philedelphia to name a few. What do these two groups have in common? If one block decided to vote one way, as in ALL the farmers or ALL of one population center, it would have decided the entire outcome of the vote. Lets bring this into the modern day. Say all of New York City, Los Angeles and San Fransico decided to vote for Candidate X. That's about 30 million votes right there. That would be pretty tough to beat, right? You would just about have to carry the rest of the country, assuming that 50% of the country was still voting and not a single person in the entire US also votes for Candidate X.
It is this type of voting that our founding fathers didn't want. One population center, or just one group, ruling everyone. So they came up with the electoral college. Even if you carry New York and California, which have the largest population centers, you could still lose as we saw in 2000. This wasn't a mistake on their part. It was/ is a safe guard and I'm glad it's there.
Don't romanticise the Clinton era. He was good with the economy, and some foreign relations, but he was bad for the military and slack on a good bit of foreign relations. Just like our current president. He's good in some areas, bad in others. We look back on Lincoln and we see one of the greatest presidents, and human being, ever. Back in his day though, half of the US thought he was nuts and that is just in the Northern states alone! Won't even touch what the South thought of him. Only time will tell of the impact this government will have on this world. We're too close the epicenter of the events to see the outward ripples.
The End
PS- Personally, I don't give two shits what the rest of the world thinks of us. We've bailed the world out of so many situations, monetarily, equipment, US servicemen lives, since 1914 that we're allowed a mulligan or two. Did you know that England and Russia never paid us back for all the money and equipment we gave to them during WW2? They said, "We're not going to pay" and we didn't push the subject. We didn't invade them and we didn't do an economic/ logistic embargo on them. Also, did you know that in certain parts of our loving, all knowing, neighbors to the north that the Bible is considered hate speech and is not allowed to be taught? Class over.
Staff Sergant Thowarr, USAF, active duty, Keesler AFB, Biloxi MS
First of all i just cut and pasted that Clinton vs. Bush rant, so what you think you know about my opinion you don't. I also don't delite in ppl dying as a result of terrorism to boost my countries economy, another american hating the world becuz no1 likes you. You guys live in a bubble and I'm sure you will say you don't care what ppl think of you or your country. But you only say that cuz you know no1 outside of america likes america. I'm not saying I hate your country I just hate your president. He is an IDIOT and grudge you are obviously one of those ppl who doesn't seem to care.
And yes I do worry about it becuz like I said before the "leader of the free world bullshit" AFFECTS the world.
And yes I do worry about it becuz like I said before the "leader of the free world bullshit" AFFECTS the world.
Ok I think you need to step back a second.Grudge wrote:the Canadians would have been much happier, so it seems, to just leave their good ole boy Saddam in power, no help from them eh.
A) Canada has been busy deploying troops, money, etc to Afganistan to clean up the first mess the US ran out of before finishing.
B) You shouldn't say "Canadians would have been much happier".. it's more like "The majority of the world including half the population of the US would have been much happier"
Getting Saddam out of power because he is an "evil man" eh... it would have been nice if Dubya at least said that the first time.. instead of the "links to terrorists!", then "they have WMD!", then "Iraqi freedom!", etc. I mean it would have been much more truthful just to say "He wanted to kill my dad".
I mean honestly.. anybody that thinks Iraq was a threat to the US seriously has some issues. They were absolutely ZERO threat, as all the earlier and current reports showed.
If Dubya ACTUALLY cared about terrorism and threats of attacks he would be focusing on:
A) Osama bin Ladan
B) North Korea
No country.. not Iraq, not Iran, not any.. are a more dangerous threat to the US than North Korea.
I have no sig.
Thowar,
I feel at this point in society we do not need electoral college, popular vote I say
other than that I agree 100% with what you say except for the part where you said clinton was good with the economy, NAFTA is bad for our economy and pretty much he didnt touch a working money machine in 8 years with any changes, he was just status quo.
PJ,
The courts did not allow a recount, and if you look at the "unofficial" recounts of the districts GORE was asking to be recounted bush would have won, if you looked at the "unoffical" recount of the whole state (which NOBODY asked for) then Bush would have lost... that is why I said "ironic, isnt it" because Gore would have slit his own throat by legally requesting that only the "standard democratic" districts be recounted
I feel at this point in society we do not need electoral college, popular vote I say
other than that I agree 100% with what you say except for the part where you said clinton was good with the economy, NAFTA is bad for our economy and pretty much he didnt touch a working money machine in 8 years with any changes, he was just status quo.
PJ,
The courts did not allow a recount, and if you look at the "unofficial" recounts of the districts GORE was asking to be recounted bush would have won, if you looked at the "unoffical" recount of the whole state (which NOBODY asked for) then Bush would have lost... that is why I said "ironic, isnt it" because Gore would have slit his own throat by legally requesting that only the "standard democratic" districts be recounted
a lack of public speaking skills is not a sign of lack of inteligence.PooMonkey wrote:Well Yaz let me tell youIn my opinion oh wait most of the worlds opinion except some Americans who can't see the forest for the trees. He is a complete moron who probably can't even spell his own name. No matter what we do living in Canada, Great Britain or Iraq what your president does affects everyone's lives. Lucky for us he is too inept to create a good economy, meaning our canadian dollar is on the rise. C'mon guys for real he is an idiot and everyone but the american public can see it. Mind you not all of the U.S. is not blind to this. Maybe it is a pride thing, no1 wants to admit they hired a complete moron to run their country. I watched CNN the other night and they had a world vote to see which country would elect who as president. LOL the only country that said they would vote Bush back into office was France lol if that doesn't prove it to you nothing will.
Gore tried the "he is dumb" campaign and guess what, Gore never got a masters (but he tried so he musta flunked out) while Bush did, so who was the idiot?
and grudge, amen brother.
ack, I said I was done with this thread
here is why america is great, here is why americans could give a rats ass what the rest of the world thinks. This was in 1973, but pretty much it is still all 100% true. Nobody does a thing for us, but we are the humanitarians, the watch dog, the technology developers and the babysitter for the world. The only way america can get more critisizm from the world for doing something is by not doing it because they EXPECT us to do something to help them.
oh and this is a canadians writing fyi
"LET'S BE PERSONAL" Broadcast June 5, 1973 CFRB, Toronto, Ontario
Topic: "The Americans"
The United States dollar took another pounding on German, French and British exchanges this morning, hitting the lowest point ever known in West Germany. It has declined there by 41% since 1971 and this Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most generous and possibly the least-appreciated people in all the earth.
As long as sixty years ago, when I first started to read newspapers, I read of floods on the Yellow River and the Yangtze. Who rushed in with men and money to help? The Americans did.
They have helped control floods on the Nile, the Amazon, the Ganges and the Niger. Today, the rich bottom land of the Misssissippi is under water and no foreign land has sent a dollar to help. Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy, were lifted out of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of those countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.
When the franc was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.
When distant cities are hit by earthquakes, it is the United States that hurries into help... Managua Nicaragua is one of the most recent examples. So far this spring, 59 American communities have been flattened by tornadoes. Nobody has helped.
The Marshall Plan .. the Truman Policy .. all pumped billions upon billions of dollars into discouraged countries. Now, newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent war-mongering Americans.
I'd like to see one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplanes.
Come on... let's hear it! Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tristar or the Douglas 107? If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all international lines except Russia fly American planes? Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or women on the moon?
You talk about Japanese technocracy and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy and you get automobiles. You talk about American technocracy and you find men on the moon, not once, but several times ... and safely home again. You talk about scandals and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everyone to look at. Even the draft dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on our streets, most of them ... unless they are breaking Canadian laws .. are getting American dollars from Ma and Pa at home to spend here.
When the Americans get out of this bind ... as they will... who could blame them if they said 'the hell with the rest of the world'. Let someone else buy the Israel bonds, Let someone else build or repair foreign dams or design foreign buildings that won't shake apart in earthquakes.
When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both are still broke. I can name to you 5,000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other people in trouble.
Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake.
Our neighbours have faced it alone and I am one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them kicked around. They will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles.
I hope Canada is not one of these. But there are many smug, self-righteous Canadians. And finally, the American Red Cross was told at its 48th Annual meeting in New Orleans this morning that it was broke.
This year's disasters .. with the year less than half-over… has taken it all and nobody...but nobody... has helped.
ORIGINAL SCRIPT AND AUDIO
COURTESY STANDARD BROADCASTING CORPORATION LTD.
(c) 1973 BY GORDON SINCLAIR
PUBLISHED BY STAR QUALITY MUSIC (SOCAN)
A DIVISION OF UNIDISC MUSIC INC.
578 HYMUS BOULEVARD
POINTE-CLAIRE, QUEBEC,
CANADA, H9R 4T2
oh and this is a canadians writing fyi
"LET'S BE PERSONAL" Broadcast June 5, 1973 CFRB, Toronto, Ontario
Topic: "The Americans"
The United States dollar took another pounding on German, French and British exchanges this morning, hitting the lowest point ever known in West Germany. It has declined there by 41% since 1971 and this Canadian thinks it is time to speak up for the Americans as the most generous and possibly the least-appreciated people in all the earth.
As long as sixty years ago, when I first started to read newspapers, I read of floods on the Yellow River and the Yangtze. Who rushed in with men and money to help? The Americans did.
They have helped control floods on the Nile, the Amazon, the Ganges and the Niger. Today, the rich bottom land of the Misssissippi is under water and no foreign land has sent a dollar to help. Germany, Japan and, to a lesser extent, Britain and Italy, were lifted out of the debris of war by the Americans who poured in billions of dollars and forgave other billions in debts. None of those countries is today paying even the interest on its remaining debts to the United States.
When the franc was in danger of collapsing in 1956, it was the Americans who propped it up and their reward was to be insulted and swindled on the streets of Paris. I was there. I saw it.
When distant cities are hit by earthquakes, it is the United States that hurries into help... Managua Nicaragua is one of the most recent examples. So far this spring, 59 American communities have been flattened by tornadoes. Nobody has helped.
The Marshall Plan .. the Truman Policy .. all pumped billions upon billions of dollars into discouraged countries. Now, newspapers in those countries are writing about the decadent war-mongering Americans.
I'd like to see one of those countries that is gloating over the erosion of the United States dollar build its own airplanes.
Come on... let's hear it! Does any other country in the world have a plane to equal the Boeing Jumbo Jet, the Lockheed Tristar or the Douglas 107? If so, why don't they fly them? Why do all international lines except Russia fly American planes? Why does no other land on earth even consider putting a man or women on the moon?
You talk about Japanese technocracy and you get radios. You talk about German technocracy and you get automobiles. You talk about American technocracy and you find men on the moon, not once, but several times ... and safely home again. You talk about scandals and the Americans put theirs right in the store window for everyone to look at. Even the draft dodgers are not pursued and hounded. They are here on our streets, most of them ... unless they are breaking Canadian laws .. are getting American dollars from Ma and Pa at home to spend here.
When the Americans get out of this bind ... as they will... who could blame them if they said 'the hell with the rest of the world'. Let someone else buy the Israel bonds, Let someone else build or repair foreign dams or design foreign buildings that won't shake apart in earthquakes.
When the railways of France, Germany and India were breaking down through age, it was the Americans who rebuilt them. When the Pennsylvania Railroad and the New York Central went broke, nobody loaned them an old caboose. Both are still broke. I can name to you 5,000 times when the Americans raced to the help of other people in trouble.
Can you name me even one time when someone else raced to the Americans in trouble? I don't think there was outside help even during the San Francisco earthquake.
Our neighbours have faced it alone and I am one Canadian who is damned tired of hearing them kicked around. They will come out of this thing with their flag high. And when they do, they are entitled to thumb their nose at the lands that are gloating over their present troubles.
I hope Canada is not one of these. But there are many smug, self-righteous Canadians. And finally, the American Red Cross was told at its 48th Annual meeting in New Orleans this morning that it was broke.
This year's disasters .. with the year less than half-over… has taken it all and nobody...but nobody... has helped.
ORIGINAL SCRIPT AND AUDIO
COURTESY STANDARD BROADCASTING CORPORATION LTD.
(c) 1973 BY GORDON SINCLAIR
PUBLISHED BY STAR QUALITY MUSIC (SOCAN)
A DIVISION OF UNIDISC MUSIC INC.
578 HYMUS BOULEVARD
POINTE-CLAIRE, QUEBEC,
CANADA, H9R 4T2
Just 1 question on this. If NO1 likes our country, then why the hell does everyone try to get into it? Mexicans,Cubans, they are all trying to get into our country. Why? Because they know it offers a better life! So don't say NO1 outside of America likes America. These are just some examples. Thowar and Grudge, very nice post. Well put. I also agree that some people are better at somethings than others, and that goes for Presidents also. I would also like to thank Clinton and Kerry for down sizing our military. If it wasn't for them our military wouldn't be stretched so dam thin that we have to call up so many reservists and the IRRs(Inactive Ready Reservists).PooMonkey wrote: You guys live in a bubble and I'm sure you will say you don't care what ppl think of you or your country. But you only say that cuz you know no1 outside of america likes america. AFFECTS the world.
Yaz that article by some French guy is over 30 years old man.. from somebody that means nothing... not to mention that was right before the US started doing all of Isreal's dirty work.
Why don't you track down the guy that wrote it and ask him what he thinks of Bush and the current state of the US and global policies.. I bet you'll get a whole different story. I mean hey if you could rewind the US 30 years I would be saying great things about the country and government too.
EDIT:
Also anybody that says nobody does a thing for the US is obviously very stupid. Considering Isreal and Saudi alone OWN over 25% of the US. The country would never have gotten anywhere without the money.
Why don't you track down the guy that wrote it and ask him what he thinks of Bush and the current state of the US and global policies.. I bet you'll get a whole different story. I mean hey if you could rewind the US 30 years I would be saying great things about the country and government too.
EDIT:
Also anybody that says nobody does a thing for the US is obviously very stupid. Considering Isreal and Saudi alone OWN over 25% of the US. The country would never have gotten anywhere without the money.
Last edited by Imperil on Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:25 pm, edited 1 time in total.
I have no sig.
Açieeed! style by