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Thowarr
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Post by Thowarr »

The war of 1812 the US wanted to take over Canada. Sure they broke from Britain, AFTER the fact that Canada was unable to be captured. Canada didn't beat the US on their own obviously, Britain helped the whole time.

I have seen some US history books and it makes you chuckle, so I know why you're asking those questions. They very rarely even mention the attack on Canada and that it was a complete loss.. and the burning of the white house is even seldom seen. Although if you read some non-US text you get the full story.

Don't get me wrong, once the US changed the main objective.. to break from Britain instead of taking over Canada, I would call that a victory.. although the initial cause was lost.
I have a question? What American school did you attend? The one I attended, and my state is considered to be last in the nation, taught that yes Canada did come down and burn our capital after the battle of York, where we burned a town. A British colony town. We also learned that the reasons for the Battle of 1812 were thus:

- Failure of the British to withdraw from American territory along the Great Lakes

- British backing of the Indians on America's frontiers

- British unwillingness to sign commercial agreements favorable to the United States.

- British impressment of American sailors into the British navy to fight the French

- Failure of both British and French navies to respect American shipping neutrality

We wanted Britian to leave us alone. We were happy to continue to supply them oak for their navies so they could fight the French and with food, but we didn't want them near us. We just fought a war with them. It wasn't immediate hugs and kisses all around.
For people that only want money and possessions all the power to them. That is all I ever hear in an argument with the US.. power this.. power that.. just read the thread. Whereas in Canada I could care less how much power we have, or military size.. it's about my free healthcare system taking care of everyone, the pension system that makes the US one look like a joke, the social programs that are free. I value quality of life over quantity of possessions.
So I guess that all the people that come because of religious persecution, for the superior college education and for just the better way of life are all greedy, power hungry bastards? That's right, they came for the money. Not because their sister, mother and father were exterminated because they were Jewish, Muslim, Communist, Leftist, Rightist... take your pick. This just shows what kind of bubble your living in, and what you perceive as "true" information coming from your supposedly superior information sources. Of course, if it's not American news, it has to be true and better. What a crock.

Your able to have a better health care system because, one, you have a 1/10th of our population; two, you get all the best drugs from us dirt cheap. Why do you think all of our seniors want to buy the same drugs from Canada for like a third of the price and our government wants to stop that? Yeah, our health care system is kind of messed up, but I don't hear about people going to Canada for emergency life saving treatments. They come to us. We have the best doctors and facilities period. It costs more, and I acknowledge that, but to get the best you sometimes have to pay more. As far as my pension, I can retire at age 41 and not have to work anymore for the rest of my life, with free medical and dental for me and my family. Can you? And our social programs vary from state to state. If you're an expert on 50 different states, and all the accompanying counties and towns, then you know more about our system than most.

Americans value quality of life alot. That's one of the biggest reasons people immigrate to our country. Quality of life. If you're not having to lock your door everynight then you're probably living out in the country. Have you ever lived in a big city? No matter what major metropolitan city you live in, there will be crime. That's a fact. If you try, again, to lay this shit on me about how Canada is oh so safe, then you're in your own bubble. Where I grew up, and where my parents/ grandparents/ great grandparents/ (it keeps going), grew up we never had to lock our doors. My parents still don't. Most of our country is like that, because most of our country doesn't live in a big metropolitan area. Half the people I work with come from isolated towns where their nearest resident was two miles away. Where everybody knows one another because the town has a population of 650 and they would all bend over backwards to help each other out. That's what America is mainly about. That's one of our driving forces, helping others. The Berlin airlift, the continuing support we give to African nations in terms of economic/ food aid, the Asian nations routinely hit by typhoons, the Eastern European nations hit by famine, flood and earthquakes... the list goes on. Do you know how many frickin' US Air Force airlifts there are each year just in support of humanitarian missions? Do you know what a tax on resources that is? Those resources could be used for a ton of different things, but because we know that if we didn't do it, it wouldn't be done. Even before UN resolutions are passed, which take forever, we over there doing it. We value quality of life.

It appears that you're only getting your information from one source. You have no clue what it is to be an American. You seem to have no clue the 5000 different things the world wants us to be: protector, caregiver, endless ATM machine, doormat. As soon as you and the rest of the world decide on what you want us to be, I'll give you a quarter so you can call someone who gives a shit.
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Archangelus
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Post by Archangelus »

Umm....yeah, i'll pass comment....

*stay away, Arch....stay away - you said you would....now stay away....*

8-p

I blame poo!
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Ayyyla
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Post by Ayyyla »

I like eggs.
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This_name_sucks
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Post by This_name_sucks »

Well I think its about time I show a British opinion. BULLSHIT. I was born in Britain, but what the hell is this 'WE' crap. I'm nothing like the next person along. I am british by birth right. I'm not british by behaviour... and you're not American by what you do, though if American stands for an upstanding well behaved citizen, then most of you are that (the same goes for Canadian and every other country). But the actual word 'American' is a nationality. You can't just say we Americans did blah blah and blah for the rest of the world, with no disrespect to those of you that have given to other countries. I reckon some Americans probably have done bugger all for other countries, but when America is complimented or thanked, they quite willingly take the comments. I think that it isn't a nationality that decides who you are, that just creates stereotypes. No, instead we are individuals and unfortunately that is not focused upon enough. I'm not saying we should all be recluses that live in our own holes and never share, but categorising us is stupid. So from now on in this forum, I would appreciate if you talk about specific groups of people or individuals that helped, even if you don't know the name, because saying 'we' Americans is stupid.
I understand that you all contribute to the economy by working and paying taxes, but who of you could honestly say that you would give all that if you didn't need to earn money to feed your families, or pay taxes by law. I know a few of you would willingly, but no names mentioned. In my opinion, Bush is an unfortunate recipient of a lot of criticism. When you're in an important position like he is, we sometimes forget that he is human too. If you were ruling the country, you'd make mistakes. Yes from what I have heard I dislike Bush, but I am unwilling to pass judgement when I don't know the man personally. For all I know he could be the most likeable man on Earth, or someone that is so annoying or evil, that he is probably best left alone. I think the mentality of the argument is that one side feel, I think I'll have a good rant...I've heard bad things about Bush, he must be evil. Wheras the other side will think... poor Bush, I'll take the sympathetic view. I didn't read all of the froum, cause there was a lot to read and it was quite montonous in places, but I don't think anyone admitted that they had no right to give an opinion. Its the same here with Tony Blair. He makes mistakes and people think he's stupid. Its in our nature (unfortunately) to focus on people's weaknesses. I cannot pass judgement on Tony Blair or anyone I have never met. Just because you see them on TV it by no means allows you to know who that person truly is. The media only sell by focusing on people's bad qualities, thats how they sell, by applying to our natural desire for inferiority amongst others.
I personally am grateful for all that every country has done to give me what I have today. I cannot tell the world how I feel because I am labelled British. As soon as I say where I'm from, you automatically asume that I think Americans are stupid and should go find a way to pull their heads out of their arses rather than make new and exciting computer parts. This is not the case. I respect many Americans through history, for individual achievements. I respect some of you, more than you may know.
When bad things happen I don't complain, I tolerate them, besides how is me complaining going to fix the problem. Most people only say bad things about other countries because that's what they think their friends want to hear. Then you end up by evaluating a general view, which is false. As for the economy, no one man or group of men can control the economy. The American leaders have no control over individuals. Lets refer back to the Depression of the late 1920s onwards. It occured because too many individuals were buying things on credit. Why? Because America was going thorugh a boom. Buying on credit was a good idea, but the President couldn't stop them. He doesn't have the right. The economy goes up and down all the time. How could Bush have possibly stopped things like 9/11, as an example. Maybe he could have jumped in the way of the planes. That would have done it I think.
By saying that I have no right to pass judgement on people I don't know, I am not saying that they can get away with whatever they like and I won't mind. Far from it, if I know that they're buggering the country or other countries, I'll say something. I do care about who is elected and, though I cannot vote as I am underaged and not an American citizen, I will voice an opinion to those who can.
To finish, for now, I would like to say that the problem of this type of discussion starts at the beginning. It may sound obvious and pretty stupid, but it is overlooked. As soon as there is opposition, people choose to take sides. I am standing not on the fence, but in the spectator stand from afar because I am not going to say who is right, because ultimately 'we', and in this case I can say 'we', are all wrong in some way.
Last edited by This_name_sucks on Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Ayyyla
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Post by Ayyyla »

weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee oh wait...sorry. Meant weeeee as in having fun weeeeeeee. Cordon bleu is good...yum...weeeeeeee.
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This_name_sucks
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Post by This_name_sucks »

Ayla here's a mop and a bucket. Oh and take this sponge to you'll need it.










































Cleaning up Cordon Bleu takes a long time.
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Ayyyla
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Post by Ayyyla »

Cleaning up! Hell! I'm EATING IT! Cleaning it up...snicker.
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Thowarr
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Post by Thowarr »

You might have to explain what a mop and bucket are for TNS. She's not that familiar with them. :twisted:
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Ayyyla
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Post by Ayyyla »

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh that's messed up. I know what they are for, even if I'm not that familiar with them...I know something else I'm not going to be familiar with...
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DenKirson
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Post by DenKirson »

Shoes?

I'm not familiar with shoes either. (yay, Den got hundredth post!)
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Thowarr
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Post by Thowarr »

Dishes? Laundry? What? :mrgreen:
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Archangelus
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Post by Archangelus »

Someone's gonna be sleeping on the couch with the dog tonight. Don't freak out when you see Darth Dawg wagging his tail in the morning....
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Imperil
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Post by Imperil »

Thowarr wrote:
The war of 1812 the US wanted to take over Canada. Sure they broke from Britain, AFTER the fact that Canada was unable to be captured. Canada didn't beat the US on their own obviously, Britain helped the whole time.

I have seen some US history books and it makes you chuckle, so I know why you're asking those questions. They very rarely even mention the attack on Canada and that it was a complete loss.. and the burning of the white house is even seldom seen. Although if you read some non-US text you get the full story.

Don't get me wrong, once the US changed the main objective.. to break from Britain instead of taking over Canada, I would call that a victory.. although the initial cause was lost.
I have a question? What American school did you attend? The one I attended, and my state is considered to be last in the nation, taught that yes Canada did come down and burn our capital after the battle of York
That reply was not for you but Arch, he was asking about the subject.
So I guess that all the people that come because of religious persecution, for the superior college education and for just the better way of life are
Again you try to take things out of context.. you must vote republican lol! :) I said people move to the states from CANADA.. I'm not talking about other countries at all.. so please base your statements in that fact next time. Considering both points have nothing to do with Canada as we don't see religious persecution (less than the US actually) and we have some of the top schools in the world as well.
Your able to have a better health care system because, one, you have a 1/10th of our population;
You claimed earlier that the US is in pure economic control.. did you mean certain companies in the US now? .. or you are still saying the country is? Population is not a factor because our job rates are pretty much the same, and you claimed the US brings in so much more money so you should easily be able to do healthcare.

BUT

With the amount of enemies the US has ammased there is simply no way to stop spending on military. Canada's population does NOT want money spent on the military, etc.. we want healthcare and other benefits.
two, you get all the best drugs from us dirt cheap.
You should look into where a lot of the drugs actually come from.. Canada imports TONS into the US. We also create a lot of our own, more than the country exports actually. Canada manufacturers it's own drugs on a per capita basis at a higher rate than the US even!
but I don't hear about people going to Canada for emergency life saving treatments.
Well than you obviously don't listen. There are facilities in Canada that are rated as the best in the world right alongside the US.
As far as my pension, I can retire at age 41 and not have to work anymore for the rest of my life, with free medical and dental for me and my family. Can you?
Yep.. and I didn't have to forfeit my rights or kill anyone to do it. Also this is a moot point as nobody would retire at 41 unless they had no ambition. Sure you could live on it but unless I am way off the ball here would it not be under 60-70k/yr.. or do you get a higher pention if in military services in the US?
It appears that you're only getting your information from one source. You have no clue what it is to be an American.
Well according to the many invalid points you made.. it appears that you're only getting your information from one source, you haev no clue what it is to be a Canadian.

You seem to have no clue the 5000 different things the world wants us to be: protector, caregiver, endless ATM machine, doormat.
Hilarious. Endless ATM machine?? .. you're talking about the country with the largest debt in the entire world right? The one that is over 25% owned by Isreal and Saudi?

Protector? Sure maybe times countries have asked for military aid by the US.. but I will hands down gaurentee that there are at least double the cases where people have wanted the US to leave or stop occupying their interests.

Caregiver? Sure the US gives a lot of money.. but like you said it is a very rich country. If you break it down per capita so that it actually means something, or break it down economically, the US isn't actually on the top anymore.

Doormat?


Also you can say all you want.. but the single most powerful country in the world is not the US at all. Right now Isreal is the most powerful nation on earth. I mean if Isreal and Saudi cashed in (which would never happen, don't think I'm saying that) the US would instantly bankrupt.
Last edited by Imperil on Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:43 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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CoolerKing
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Post by CoolerKing »

I like cheese.
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Archangelus
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Post by Archangelus »

gah!! I want to reply!! So much to rebute!! AHHHHH!!!!

All I can say is unless you are an American, you have no clue about what it means to be one.

Same goes for Canadians. Just because I visit doesn't make me an expert - so I don't pretent to be.

Will stop there.....
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